I have recently begun working with a representative/manager - Steven Gates. Steven will work to represent me with symphony orchestras, chamber music venues, Jazz clubs, concert halls, festivals, and performing arts centers throughout the world. I am very happy be working with Steven; he is a person with a considerable variety of experience in the world of music.

Steven Gates has twenty-five years’ experience in the music business. He is a former vice-president with BMG for the RCA Victor label and former vice-president and artist manager at Columbia Artists Management (CAMI) in New York City. He works in artist representation and management, is a producer of CD projects and concerts, a music supervisor for films, and also works in tour management. His contact information can be found on the Booking page of my web site. Please visit his website at: www.stevenmgates.com

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Interview for the International Trumpet Guild Journal

The following is an edited version of the interview conducted by Dr. David Champouillon for the June 2005 issue of the International Trumpet Guild Journal.

Marvin Stamm on Expectations and Responsibility

Dr. David Champouillon is associate professor of trumpet, brass, and Jazz studies at East Tennessee State University, executive director of the Tri-Cities Jazz Fest, principal trumpet of the Johnson City Symphony and Veteran Brass, a performing artist for Bach trumpets, and reviewer for Oxford University Press, Prentice Hall, and McGraw-Hill. He has presented and performed at several International Trumpet Guild conferences and contributed articles to the journal. He is a published author of various books, has performed on numerous CDs, and is in demand across the country as a soloist and clinician.

David interviewed me for the ITG in early 2004. Highlights from that interview examine my thoughts about education, health, dedication, and performance.

David: John Haynie was your teacher at the University of North Texas. How would you characterize your relationship with him?

Marvin: John and I have maintained a close friendship over the years. I go to Denton for one reason or another once or twice a year. While there, I usually visit with him several times, sharing at least one meal. Last year, I was playing there and kind of cajoled him to come out of retirement and give me a lesson. This year when I was in Texas for two weeks, I talked him into giving me two lessons. Maybe next year I can get three! His insight as a teacher today - what he is able to see and hear when taking a lesson with him - is even more valuable than when I was a student. He still has a lot to give to me, and having him work with me is so inspiring. As he said to me, “I had you in my first decade of teaching when I was learning from all of you. I wish I had had you as a student in my fourth decade because I feel like I could have given you even more.” Well, I am getting the benefit of those years now. And, of course, I feel that he contributed a great deal to me during my student years.

If a teacher is demanding in the right way, you seldom walk out of a lesson feeling like you accomplished all that you had hoped for. But a teacher’s encouragement is most important because it can be an immense source of inspiration. As a musician, you never fully reach your goals. Every time you approach that point, you find that your goals have changed, moved farther out, expanding toward something else. A musician should always feel the need to strive to achieve something more.

David: What aspects of Mr. Haynie as a performer and teacher do you find you directly picked up from him in your teaching and performing?

Marvin: His chief influence was to my playing, as a teacher guiding me by what he saw and felt I needed to develop as a trumpet player and musician. But very special was the influence his musicality had on all of us, playing in lessons, performing on recitals, and as cornet soloist with the concert band on tour. He was an inspirational musician and teacher, demanding in a good way - he had high expectations of his students. These are things that have stuck with me.

In my Memphis upbringing, my first trumpet teacher, Perry Wilson, and my high school band director, A. E. McLain, were also very demanding musicians. I already knew from age fourteen that music was going to be my life. My Memphis teachers always stressed that if this was going to be the dream I would follow, then the dedication and the expectation of lifelong hard work must be a “given.” When I came to North Texas, it wasn’t that I liked to play trumpet. I was driven to it; it was my passion. So when Mr. Haynie got me, he had someone who wanted what he had to give. He didn’t have to tell me to practice my scales or Herbert L. Clarke or Schlossberg. When I went into a lesson, he saw things that I needed to work on, and he would tell me to work on this in order to correct that. Or he’d say, “We’ve reached this level, now let’s take it to the next level and proceed from there.” Then I would immediately head to the practice room.

I don’t teach very much other than the occasional student who comes to my home and is interested in my approach to music. I have no interest in teaching anyone who doesn’t have that passion for music. Today, when talking to students or teachers, like you, about their students, and particularly when performing with students groups, I see very few that show that drive, that hunger, that we had. Students just don’t seem to possess the same passion for music as we did. I know that when you studied with Gil Johnson, he never had to tell you to practice your scales, excerpts, or anything like that.

David: His teaching was really the same as Mr. Haynie’s. He fixed something that was wrong by giving an exercise or assignment that would correct the problem. As with all of my teachers, he wasn’t there to “baby-sit” me while I learned my scales or Clarke studies. I would have been embarrassed to go to the lesson unprepared and sound bad.

Marvin: Of course! You were driven by your love of playing, and he worked with that.

David: Are you still as driven to reach the next goal? We have talked many times about how students are different than your generation. What differences do you notice in students today?

Marvin: The difference in my public school days was that the teachers were in charge. They had control of the curriculum and your day-to-day schedule. You were expected - “expect” is a tremendous word - to rise to their expectations. In other words, if you didn’t make the grade, you didn’t pass. Teachers expected you to learn what they had to offer. By failing to do so, you penalized nobody but yourself. Like today, some teachers were better than others, but regardless, the teachers were in control.

Things are certainly different today. Students feel entitlement, teachers have no disciplinary power, the administration doesn’t support the teacher, and parents think their children can do no wrong and should be held responsible for nothing. It was totally opposite when I was in school, and the last thing a student wanted was for the school to send a note home to his parents saying he had misbehaved. The punishment at home would be much worse than any received at school!

David: It is important to realize that there is always someone in charge - whether it be the parent, teacher, bandleader, etc. “Concerns” can be brought up in the right way. I think the key is to voice your concern without stepping over the boundaries. I will admit it was and is hard, growing up as a student who was expected to do what the teacher said, to adjust to the students of today who have been taught to question more. The best teachers of today can balance these two styles of teaching. Eventually, someone has to be in control.

Marvin: Of course. When I grew up, parents were always presumed to be right. Obviously, parents are NOT always right. I fought with my parents as most young people do. Fortunately, my folks, particularly my mother, were open enough to know when I was saying something that was right for me. She would see that and would many times be an interlocutor between my dad and me. My dad and I have very similar personalities - very stubborn - so there were times when we butted heads on issues. She would help him come around to see things, though it wasn’t always easy to do. My parents were born in the early 1900s and were products of the generation that experienced the Great Depression, so their parenting was illustrative of what was prevalent at that time.

No one wants to go back to that kind or parenting, least of all me. My wife Nancy and I didn’t raise our children that way. But there must be expectations, guidelines, and parameters. Parameters need to be set and young people need to adhere to them; they cry out for that even though they may be rebelling against them.

It is sad that teachers are not allowed to lay down rules today. I think this is one of the really definitive things that differentiate my growing up from what is going on today. Today, teachers do not get the support of the administration when - or even if - they are allowed to set the rules. Principals don’t want to look bad to the superintendents or board members; consequently, they don’t want to see a lot of students failing. So, too many students are being shuffled out of school without having learned anything. In many cases, parents come running, screaming at the administration about excessive expectations of the students, “My child this and my child that. . . .”

As for discipline, teachers would rather not have to resort to discipline, but they must have some authority if a student is disruptive and doesn’t want to do the work. How can anyone teach if discipline and rules don’t exist? Should we penalize those students who want to learn by “cow towing” to the few who choose to “goof off”? In any working society there must be rules and enforcement of those rules. Human nature demands it to be that way. Someone once said, “Freedom with no boundaries is anarchy.”

David: Those students who do what their teachers require, without the arguing and/or complaining - being willing to defer to authority - are typically the most successful. When they ask a question, it is based on a thirst for knowledge rather than arguing or standing up to authority. The students who argue just to rebel are typically the students who fail or take longer to reach their goals. Of course, there are those students in-between. I do like the student who asks, “Why are we doing this? What does it accomplish?” as a learning tool. After all, they are to become the next generation of teachers.

Marvin: And they have the right to know the purpose for doing something. It provides motivation and a stronger incentive to reach their goal, as well as the knowledge to pass what they have learned to others. How many years have we heard that we must practice “long tones” as part of the curriculum? Yet, many times, students have no idea why they should practice long tones. Their teachers don’t explain why they need this exercise or what they should be listening for – or, in fact, what they should be trying to accomplish. But it is very important that they know. It is more obvious when starting to practice the Clarke studies that improvement of technique, that is, the coordination of fingers, embouchure, and wind are the purpose. Yes, working on long tones is needed to improve sound – but how? What does it mean? Practicing something like long tones with no thought as to what you are trying to achieve may not lead to much improvement. Students need to have in their minds and ears what they are striving to accomplish.

David: Yes, I have always stressed the importance to my students of the difference between practicing and playing. They want to play, not correct what may be wrong. Laurie McGaw, one of my teachers and now retired associate principal trumpet of the San Francisco Symphony, always used to say “Practiced slop produces perfect slop.”

Academia, at times, doesn’t let the teacher push the students in the right way, toward achieving their best. Restrictions like tenure and promotion are in the mix. The concept of student evaluations can be good or not. These processes are not necessarily bad, unless the students use it as a way to complain or not accept responsibility for their actions or lack of actions in terms of practicing. When you were at NT were the students expected or allowed to evaluate the teacher?

Marvin: There was no such thing as teacher evaluations by the students then. When you really think about it, student evaluations of the teachers and the value an administration places on them brings up the point, “Are the inmates running the asylum”? Who needs this? The evaluation of any teacher is seen in the success of his or her students. If you have an obviously fine teacher, any student who has ability and is really paying attention should do well, whether in music or any other subject. The student who doesn’t show up to class, study the material - or, in our case, practice - is the one who will not improve no matter what the teacher does.

On what basis or experiences do most students possess the knowledge and capacity to evaluate their teacher, other than with their subjective viewpoints based on the amount of effort they put forth? Maybe it’s possible in some rare cases, but these are certainly the exception. And I’ve been told that some students have used the evaluations to coerce teachers into giving them better or passing grades. The administration has to look at the entire record of the student evaluations of teachers. I am sure this record is probably on file, and administrations should be able to tell from that whether the student is giving a true evaluation. But passing students just to get rid of them is certainly no help to anyone - or no answer to the problem.

David: Faculty always has to walk the tightrope in terms of a place between being demanding and having expectations and having students complain. We get bad evaluations typically from those who don’t want to practice or do the required assignments. It starts in - or even before - high school. As we discussed, the students are not held accountable. Teachers, at times, can’t afford turning away or losing students because they are held accountable for recruitment and retention. Many teachers are held accountable to administrators or alumni who want a huge band at the football games rather than being concerned with quality. Many students arrive at college not ready for a teacher who expects their best! They are not used to criticism, even when it is done the correct way. Comments like the picking of literature come up a lot.

Marvin: Well, how many students really know enough literature to pick the right material? A teacher’s job is to be a guide for the students, teaching them through the years how to do these things by exposing them to a variety of music. As for criticism, many teachers have expressed to me that they are very discouraged in dealing with students. They are discouraged from having strong expectations or high standards. Some students take a teacher’s critique as “putting them down.” How does one teach if he can’t point out what is not correct in the student’s playing?

Regarding teachers being held accountable for recruitment and retention, many teachers tell me they feel that universities are playing a “numbers game,” that is, bodies in/bodies out! They say that it is as much about business today as it is about education. If this is truly what it is all about, we are in deep trouble. Young people - our students - are the future of this country, and if we sell them short in such a way, we are not only cheating them, we are demeaning our most important resource and destroying our future.

David: As teachers, we try to instill superior work ethic into each student, including responsibility and reliability so the student can be successful in the work force. But those who won’t practice or do the assigned work don’t learn anything. This isn’t the teacher’s fault, but the student’s.

Marvin: Of course, it is their responsibility, and, unfortunately, responsibility is something that most people shy away from. It seems that too many people today don’t want to take responsibility for their lives. In many students’ opinions, it is always someone else’s fault when they fail. People must realize that self-motivation and responsibility are very important to all of us. If the only stimuli one experiences comes from outside influences rather than from within, then that person doesn’t have much character.

I ask music education classes and student groups with which I work or perform how many of them continue to practice, taking their music to a higher level? Many respond that they don’t need to practice anymore because they are planning to become band directors. How do they expect to stand in front of 60 middle school students or 100 high school students and inspire them to play concert music that bears no relationship to any of the outside musical influences the students hear? How can you inspire others when you are not inspired yourself? A great deal of being a band director is being an inspiration to the students! How are future educators like these going to accomplish anything worthwhile, much less put a music program together? Are they going to teach the kids by rote? What will they learn from that? Where is the responsibility?

This attitude is like the “no child left behind” concept - teaching students by rote. Unfortunately, this is the way a number of band directors approach their bands - teaching the students three or four pieces by rote all year long so they can go into a competition and bring home some plastic trophy. I was recently involved in a discussion where it was argued that counting prizes won is the only way to hold teachers accountable. Amazing! You can teach a piece of music note for note, but are the students learning anything? I think not.

The process of learning - in music or any other subject - is by doing! You learn how to solve a problem by mastering the process, like learning how to play a difficult passage by practicing it on your own, breaking it down, then putting it all together again to be able to play it right. This most important lesson in education is learning to do it yourself! We probably retain only about 10% of what we learn in school, the rest going by the wayside because we don’t use it. But the most important thing we learn is the process by which we find our own solutions to problems - in life or in music. If all you know is what somebody else drills into you - ad nauseum - you will function as a robot that must be programmed to function.

David: Along these lines, I try to instill in students the need to be their own best teacher, After all, they spend only one hour - at some schools only thirty minutes a week - in a lesson with the teacher. They practice the other six days - hopefully it is six - practicing by themselves. This is a vital step in their transformation from student to teacher. I am always amazed when great players like you tell me what they are working on lately. For example, you still work on things like the Charlier book. Your dedication to being the best musician you can be seems only to intensify, including taking periodic checkup lessons with Mr. Haynie, for example.

Marvin: Yes, I am still working on things like Charlier, Bozza, Clarke, Caruso, and the methods of Mr. Haynie and Tony Plog. I had some time off this summer so I went back into the Bodet book. All this serves to inspire me. I am 65 years old and still see room to improve because I always want to play better. Every good musician I know wakes up hoping he will play better this day than the day before - and goes to bed each night hoping he will play better tomorrow than today. Music and the ability to play an instrument is a never-ending journey. It goes on and on. You never reach the pinnacle. Yes, you reach peaks, but you must continually try to climb the next peak farther out. It all depends how interested you are in continuing to work on your instrument, music, and learning. I find music to be most fascinating, always inspiring - particularly playing with the great musicians with whom I perform. Sometimes people ask when I might want to retire. Why would I retire from something I love to do? My love is playing music - more today than ever before! And as long as I keep growing and playing well, why should I stop!

David: It is obvious to anyone who hears you play that you maintain dedication to trumpet. How is this dedication otherwise affected by the demands of your career?

Marvin: Many things, including family and health, affect it to be sure. I am fortunate that my family has always been supportive of me. In the early years of my studio work, I was home and had the opportunity to be there for them. The girls were fairly grown and becoming pretty independent when I started backing out of the studios. Nancy has always been an independent spirit, so this allowed me to tour without feeling that I was abandoning them. Now the girls are grown and following their own paths, and Nancy pursues her own interests, but we get to spend a lot of time together when I’m off the road.

Health is a big issue to me - to anyone who tours - and I have been a runner/jogger since 1970. Recently, I joined a gym near my home where I work out every other day in addition to my daily running. I love to eat well, and after work or on a night off I enjoy a glass of good wine. But I believe in the old adage, “Everything in moderation, nothing in excess.” Taking care of your health, getting exercise, and being reasonably aware of the food you eat can help to maintain your strength, keep your body in good shape, and make you feel good. I believe taking care of the body helps with one’s trumpet playing.

David:  It was a thrill for the students here and for me to have your quartet as featured artist at the Tri-Cities Jazz Festival back in April. I had the opportunity to ask some of the members of your quartet to speak about playing with you. Bill Mays said “I've been involved in duo and quartet music making with Marvin Stamm over the past 10 years. Each time I'm on the bandstand, I know I can look forward to "agenda-free" music-making, spontaneity of the first order, and freedom. Marvin gives each member in the group lots of solo space as well as a platform in which to present original compositions!” Ed Soph said, “Marvin lets the music happen. It's that simple. He's open for anything. He listens. He cares.” Rufus Reid said, “Marvin exemplifies what world-class really means and what all schools wish of their students. He brings honesty, integrity, and passion for music wherever he goes. I am proud to be his friend and always look forward to making music with him.” As it is great to get the acceptance of your teachers, even better when it come from your peers! I understand you recently released a new CD with your quartet.

Marvin: Yes, but first, let me say something about these three marvelous musicians. These people are extraordinary players, and every moment on the stage with them is the fulfillment of my musical fantasy! I may be the leader in an organizational sense, but when it comes to the music, we share the musical leadership in that everyone is an equal partner. The music is “of the moment,” and the respect and love we all feel for one another allows each of us to speak what we want as we feel it. The same holds true of our personal relationship. Excuse me for saying this - and I mean it in the most humble way - if you have not heard this group, you have missed something special. These musicians are truly inspirational.

About our new CD - The quartet was recorded "live" at our NYC appearance at Birdland last September. Guitarist John Abercrombie guested with us and appears on four of the eight tracks. The CD was released in March on the Jazzed Media label. We are all really happy with this recording, especially hearing how close-knit the group has become over the past few years and how much challenging music this group produces.

A CD is - or should be - the musical documentation of where an artist is at a certain point in his or her musical growth. Many artists lose sight of this and view a CD as their path to stardom. Not only is this an erroneous concept, but it will also lead to great disappointment in most cases. The recording business is - and has been - in great disarray for a number of years, especially regarding the Jazz idiom. For example, some time ago Warner Bros. dropped most of its Jazz department. Companies for years have been trying to sell their Jazz artists and CDs as they do "pop" artists rather than trying to develop their artist catalogues to sell well over a number of years as they did in the ‘40s, ‘50s, ‘60s, and part of the ‘70s. Fusion Jazz was the beginning of trying to market Jazz as "pop" music; this move was followed by the era of the "young lions." While this marketing strategy might have worked to some extent in the short term, it has been a disastrous long-term failure for both the artists and the companies. But which was hurt most? Certainly not the record companies! So the point is this: Be true to your music and let that lead you where it will. Don’t ever sacrifice the integrity of your music.

David: Advice for up and coming trumpeters?

Marvin: Of course, the basic advice is to realize that becoming a musician requires one to dedicate himself or herself to the lifelong task of mastering one's instrument and to the study of all kinds of music, regardless of the area one might wish to focus one's career upon. Versatility is the key to employment, and a Jazz or classical trumpeter hoping to focus on an artistic career might have to work in other fields of music until the opportunity to focus on their artistic path presents itself. And one of the keys to this - after achieving a certain level of mastery - is focusing more on the making of music than on just the trumpet. We have an enormous number of "super technical" players today, but a smaller number of true musicians. Maybe this has happened because the stress in so many areas is for one to become a "trumpet jock." We all know of what I am speaking. Maybe it is now considered an outdated concept, but the lesson as I learned it was - always - the music comes first.

David: On behalf of the ITG, trumpeters, Jazz lovers, and musicians all over the world, congratulations. And thanks for the wonderful example you continue to be, both musically and personally. In closing, what “expectations” do you have for yourself in the future?

Marvin: My expectations are to continue to pursue the musical path I have always taken, continually striving to play better and more creatively. I intend to maintain my honesty in the face of a world that seldom appreciates honesty - and to encourage others through my music and my writings to do the same. I want to celebrate the many wonderful people I have come to know in and out of music and keep them in my life. As long as this is what my life is all about, it will have deep meaning and much joy for me.

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This interview, which appeared on AllAbout Jazz.com, was conducted in response to a number of subjects posed to me. In this interview, I once again give my thoughts on a broad overview of musical subjects. In his own words: “Interviewer Craig Jolley listens to a variety of music and writes about jazz for All About Jazz and other publications. He remains optimistic about the state of creative music.” Craig opens the interview with the following statement:

Soloist, bandleader, lead trumpeter, cultural activist, educator, website maintainer, and southern gentleman, Marvin Stamm functions on the highest plane in all his capacities. Like most musicians who succeed these days, he communicates with his audience and brings them into his music. A sensitive yet extroverted player, Stamm has a new CD by his working quartet with guest artist John Abercrombie.

The Stamm/Soph Project - Live at Birdland

My present quartet - Bill Mays, piano, Ed Soph, drums, and Rufus Reid, bass - has been together for eight or nine years. Five years ago, Ed Soph and I decided to record a CD with the quartet that we entitled The Stamm/Soph Project. We invited tenor and soprano saxophonist Dave Liebman to guest on three tracks. The CD enjoyed nice reviews and was well received. Since that time, Ed and I talked quite a bit about doing a live album. In the studio, you can be very well prepared and probably produce a more perfect CD, but it is difficult to capture the magic that happens in front of a live audience.

In September 2003, the group was booked for a private concert in Connecticut, the COTA Festival in the Delaware Water Gap, and a four-day stint in Birdland - all within eight days. This seemed like the perfect time to do a live album because we would be playing together a lot during that period, and Birdland is one of the really nice clubs to play in New York City. Birdland provides an excellent listening environment for the customer and also has excellent recording equipment installed.

I asked engineer Jim Anderson to record these Birdland sets because he is one of the best at live recording. Jim has engineered projects for so many people, and I have known and worked with him for many years. He has also recorded many live concerts for NPR, including “Jazz at the Kennedy Center” with Billy Taylor and others. Jim has great ears, knows how to record acoustic instruments, and is a pleasure to work with.

We invited guitarist John Abercrombie to do the Birdland gig with us. John is a very sensitive musician with whom we have worked in concert before, and he fits right into what we do. John guests on four tunes and sounds wonderful as always. We recorded two of the four nights in Birdland and came out with more good material than we needed. Of course, Ed and I narrowed it down to the eight tracks - about sixty-five minutes - that we feel really reflects how this group works.

About the music, it just so happened that all eight tracks we selected are originals. There are two tunes each by Bill, Rufus, and me, and one each by saxophonist Ted Nash and Swedish pianist Lars Jansson. To my ear, most Jazz composers’ originals seem to come out naturally sounding like “Jazz” lines. But when I was listening to these tunes closely during the “mixing” sessions with Jim Anderson, I was struck by how melodic all of them are - how much like “standards” they sounded to me.

What can I say? I love this group! The quartet musically operates almost of its own accord. I generally choose the tunes for each set, but any one of us is free to offer his input. Depending upon the piece we may have just finished, the selections can change at will, on the spur of the moment. This can come from any one of us who feels that the music should go in a different direction. The group plays, and the music just flows so freely, the only constraints being an innate sensitivity and musical respect for one another and for the music. Beyond that, anything goes. We seldom discuss any of this; it is just implicit in our understanding of the way I - or rather we - want this group to function, and it does so beautifully. While I may be the protagonist of the group in a certain sense, we contribute musically as equals. This might not work so well in other group situations because egos many times come into play. None of this takes place in our quartet. We are all old and dear friends, and our personal rapport is as strong as our musical one. We come together because we love being together and making music together. It’s as simple as that. It seems that wherever we perform, people are able to sense this rapport and grasp how special this is on many levels, feeling included in the music and in the process.

This new CD - The Stamm/Soph Project - Live at Birdland - was released in March on the Jazzed Media label, and we’re very happy with it. So far the critics have liked it very much, and we’ve gotten only good comment from the people who have bought it. Phil Woods, Carl Saunders, Phil Urso, and several other artists also record with Jazzed Media. Graham Carter, the person who owns it, is a terrific guy to work with.

CDs as a leader

Besides The Stamm/Soph - Project Live at Birdland, I have four other CDs available as a leader. The previous Stamm/Soph Project was the first CD Ed and I did together. I also have the duo CD - By Ourselves - with Bill Mays done around the same time as that first Stamm/Soph Project. I love duo playing, and for me, Bill is the best!

Another quartet CD - Elegance - recorded in 2001 features pianist Stefan Karlsson, Los Angeles bassist Tom Warrington, and drummer Eliot Zigmund, who played with the Bill Evans Trio for a number of years.

I also recorded two other CDs in the ‘90s that featured saxophonist Bob Mintzer and drummer Terry Clarke - Mystery Man and Bop Boy. Mystery Man is no longer available unless MusicMasters’ parent label, the Musical Heritage Society, still has copies.

But all the other five CDs are available directly from me on my website - by credit card or any other method by which people want to pay. The direct link to purchase the CDs is: http://www.marvinstamm.com/music2.html.

The Stamm/Soph Project - Live at Birdland is also available from the usual Internet sites and in the stores, but the other CDs are available only from me.

Bill Mays

Bill Mays and I started playing together in a couple of groups around New York about ten or eleven years ago. We were kind of thrown together. We seemed to have an immediate rapport and decided we really did want to do some things together. I started using Bill in my quartet, and sometime after recording the first Stamm-Soph Project, we agreed that “we should just go into the studio, record, and see what happens.” We went into Nola Studios in New York City with Jimmy Czak, an excellent acoustic engineer.  He turned on the machine, and we just played. I’m extremely proud of the CD, By Ourselves. I believe it shows a lot of what we can do.

Since the making of By Ourselves, Bill and I have played and toured together quite a bit as a duo. We completed a two-week tour this past January. Spending two solid weeks playing with Bill is a fantastic experience! On both the musical and personal level, it is sheer fun and joy! Besides the duo performances on the tour, we played two of the concerts as a quartet. In each of these concerts, one of the regular members of my quartet happened to be in that locale and participated.

 In our concert at the University of Texas at Dallas, Ed Soph and local bassist John Adams played. John is an excellent musician and has played with us many times when we performed in Dallas and Houston. The second one was performing an afternoon master class at Indiana University (IU) and, later that evening, a concert for "Jazz from Bloomington," a not-for-profit community organization based in Bloomington, Indiana. Rufus Reid just happened to be doing a residency that week at IU, so he joined us along with drummer Steve Houghton, who is on the faculty there. Both concerts were special and received with great enthusiasm. That’s what playing is all about for me - being able to express myself freely while at the same time reaching the people for whom I am performing.

Bill Mays is A-MAYS-ING! I feel that he, more than anyone, is the major catalyst in the duo AND the quartet. I doubt Ed or Rufus would disagree with that statement. Bill and I have an uncanny magic going between us. It’s almost as if we can read each other’s thoughts. At the last concert on the tour, a duo concert at Lawrence University, we reached a new level of communication. We were presented with an archival recording of the concert, and if the sound quality were of a professional level, I would release it in a “New York minute.” It really is extraordinary. As Dick Hyman said at one of the two concerts we performed in duo for him at New York City’s well-known 92nd Street Y concert venue, “Bill and Marvin’s duo is more like chamber music than two guys just playing together.” Bill is the most creative musician I’ve ever worked with, always creative, always sensitive on the most consistent basis.

Tours combining concerts and Jazz education

All four members of the quartet are experienced in performing clinics, master classes, and workshops. We really enjoy working with young people.  Today all music of value - symphonic music, chamber music, and Jazz - is in jeopardy.  Symphony orchestras are in financial trouble, and the places in which to play Jazz are diminishing. Our audiences for great music are aging or aged, and if we don’t create new audiences from among our young people, if we don’t inspire the young players of today, then all good music may go by the wayside.

All we have to do is look at what’s going on in the political arena to see how little our elected officials value things of culture. This has been going on not just with this current administration (which in my opinion has no cultural values), but ever since Newt Gingrich raised such a big stink about pornography with the Mapplethorpe Exhibition in Washington ten or twelve years ago. “They” used the Mapplethorpe Exhibition as an excuse to cut the National Endowment for the Arts (NEA) budget from something like 163 million dollars a year to 93 million dollars.

The NEA is just a small item compared to all these other programs our legislators fund that are filled with fat and pork. The NEA was generating revenues of about 1.2 billion dollars a year on an output of 163 million. How many investments pay back eight or nine times what is put into the fund? How many of any of the things these legislators support pay back anything - except in benefit to themselves? It’s a sham - and a shame!

The only way we can be effective against this travesty is to go into our communities and encourage young people to become involved in the arts. We try to inspire young musicians to continue with their playing careers even if they decide to go into teaching. But many times, students become teachers because they think they can’t make it as players. That’s all right, of course, if they truly make teaching their priority and treat it with the same importance they would a career in performance. Teaching is one of the most important careers anyone can choose, and I believe it takes even more dedication and a deeper commitment to be a great teacher than it does to be a fine player. Case in point: If people don’t like the way I play, they don’t lose anything except maybe a few dollars for one ticket. But over a thirty-year career, a bad teacher can destroy the love of culture in hundreds of students; a great teacher can affect the opposite. When we visit these schools, we place the students first, always keeping in mind what we might do to inspire these young people to be more culturally aware, and try to get them to be really involved in the Arts and education. We hope that the teachers also pick up on what we are trying to convey and find inspiration to become better teachers – and better players.

Teaching philosophy

My philosophy of teaching comes down to this: The student is the all-important factor! Everything should always be about the student, not the teacher. Many times, this is not the case. For example, many instrumental applied music teachers consider putting their stamp on the student the most important issue in their teaching - that is, to make the student over in their own image. That may work for the self-image of the teacher, but I don’t think it serves the student well. Every student is an individual with his own individual problems and must be approached with that in mind. There is no single solution to a problem for every person because we are all different. I learned this lesson from some of the greatest teachers with whom I have come in contact: Carmine Caruso in New York, Jimmy Stamp in Los Angeles, John Haynie at the University of North Texas, Ray Crisara, professor of trumpet and head of the brass department at the University of Texas with whom I worked for years in the New York studios, and other fine teachers. The great ones always put the student first.

IAJE (International Association for Jazz Education)

IAJE has become an extremely large organization that has tried with some success to institutionalize Jazz and learning how to play this music. I believe it does serve some people well to a degree, but I also think that what it has become and the way it now operates has produced a number of negatives. For one, the organization today stands mostly to serve itself. Though it did not start out this way, it has, in its own way, become just like most other corporate-type organizations that, under the illusion of serving the community, really exists to serve itself. This happens because the membership joins for whatever they perceive are the benefits without having any responsibility for or input into guiding the direction of the organization - much like the citizenry of this country desires to live their lives today. When this occurs, the people who control the organization are free to run things to their own advantage as they please - so long as they keep the illusion alive. And now, because of the way the bylaws and organization of IAJE have been restructured over the years, it would be extremely difficult to make changes from within.

Second, IAJE and academia have led people to believe that one can teach others to play Jazz. I believe that to be completely erroneous. People aren’t taught to become improvisers - they must learn through their own efforts, not the efforts of others. As with playing an instrument, the teacher can give instructions, but without the student physically putting those instructions into effect - that is, training his or her own body to put them to use - it is impossible to learn to do so. In effect, one teaches oneself.

An oversimplified explanation of learning to improvise is this: People who develop into Jazz musicians do so because, as they develop their musical skills, they at some point in that development hear something in the music that touches them deeply, making them hungry to play this music. They get CDs and records or listen to the radio, trying to copy what they hear. Through imitation and by developing both their “ear” and a vocabulary, they acquire the musical linguistic skills over time to become Jazz improvisers.

This process is a lot like learning to talk. You can’t teach a person how to talk; he must learn how to talk “by ear,” listening to the sounds emitted by the people surrounding him and imitating them. One cannot learn the grammar of language and how language works if he can’t talk in the first place. Only after developing his ear and acquiring a vocabulary, learning how to talk, can he be taught about language. Learning to improvise is exactly the same. I know of no one who learned how to play this music first by learning theory (the grammar of music). Initially, he must develop a musical vocabulary and learn to “talk” in that language before he can be “taught grammatically” what he is doing. Only by listening and getting this music inside of you, acquiring a vocabulary and the ability to speak the language, and developing the ear can you become an improviser. After you’re able to do all this, then it is time to get into the theory.

My point is this: The IAJE - and many in the Jazz Education community - has in a well-meaning way unwittingly institutionalized the education side of this music. They have helped lead people to believe that people can be taught scales, licks, arpeggios, chord symbols and how to play on them, and they will automatically know how to improvise. That’s like saying that a child who knows the ABC’s and a few words and  phrases while possessing no real  vocabulary or linguistic skills to speak, can still put forth thoughts and ideas. That’s not possible in my view. There is no “shortcut” to the process. The teaching works only AFTER you have ability to speak or play.

Trumpet playing

I’ve been involved with this music almost from the time I picked up the horn. My older brother Gordon had a nice Jazz record collection, and I got “taken” by this music, listening and learning from so many recordings over the years. I have many heroes, not only trumpet players, but on all the instruments.  Like every other Jazz musician, I’m a product of all of the music I’ve listened to and ingested. There are things I heard from so many players that I have absorbed into my own playing, and there are things that don’t apply that I have put aside. Eventually - over time - I came to develop my own voice.

 At this point in my playing, I listen for the music. My ability to play the instrument and my technique are not things I really think about when I perform. But I continue to practice every day one to two hours depending on my schedule, and I focus on many of the same types of things I’ve done since my early years - a lot of fundamental materials to help me continue to develop and grow. It is a never-ending process. I practice as I learned - in the classical manner. I still work out of the Arban book, Herbert L. Clarke Technical Studies, many of the studies from my years with Carmine Caruso and John Haynie, my teacher at North Texas. (I see John once or twice a year when in Texas and still take lessons from him.) There are things that I still work on that Perry Wilson, my trumpet teacher in Memphis, gave me. I still play etudes by Charlier, Bozza, and others that I was playing during my years at North Texas. I’m a great lover of classical music, particularly orchestral music. I listen to as much orchestral music as Jazz these days - probably more. This kind of music also influences me greatly as it pertains to sound and personal expression.

In my Jazz playing, I am the sum of all my parts. I do not approach the instrument as a technical tool to demonstrate how flashy I can be. Rather, on stage playing with my compatriots, I try to feel everything in the environment that’s presented to me and become part of it all. When I play, I let the music dictate where I go. Depending on the piece we play, the tempo and style, it can vary from an approach of bravado to something that’s very soft and sensitive. I use vibrato where I feel it, and I use a lot of dynamics in my playing - I learned this from listening to Dizzy, who had a tremendous sense of tension and release. Today you hear a lot of trumpet players who are technically wonderful - they do things I can’t do - or at least I don’t think I can. But everything is the same volume, basically loud. They use little or no dynamic variety. Many of them also don’t pay any attention to the quality of sound, and their playing constantly stays at the same emotional level. When they play a ballad, there’s no feeling of warmth - that what they are playing is a love song. When people speak of my music, I hope some of the things said are that I am musical, I swing, and I play with taste and lots of sensitivity. Hearing these things said is a compliment of the highest order.

Lead trumpet

My lead playing began to develop somewhat during my years in Memphis and later at North Texas and between the
stints with Stan and Woody, and doing shows in Reno, Nevada. But this area really developed for me after I came to New York. Working closely for many years with Bernie Glow, Ernie Royal, and Snooky Young was learning at the feet of the masters. I was always taught to be a good section player, and to do this one must become an astute listener. So as I played next to these great players and worked and listened to them day after day, my own lead playing developed and improved.

I played lead trumpet for several years with the Thad Jones/Mel Lewis Jazz Orchestra after Snooky Young moved to California. I also played lead in the American Jazz Orchestra led by John Lewis, and for about thirteen years I played lead with the Bob Mintzer Band. During my many years in the studios, all of us played lead and section. Everyone was a versatile player and could wear many hats. Since leaving the studios around 1990, I’ve concentrated on being a Jazz soloist. Now I play lead only for George Gruntz when he puts together his Concert Jazz Band for recordings and tours in Europe and abroad.

Other than with George’s band, I no longer play with many big bands because this isn’t where my interest lies. The exception is the Westchester Jazz Orchestra (WJO) based in the area I live, Westchester County, New York, just north of New York City. The band is made up of some of the finest Jazz musicians in the New York area, all living in Westchester County. Most are also members of the Maria Schneider Orchestra, the Vanguard Orchestra, the Bob Mintzer Band, and others. It is an excellent group, and we all enjoy playing together. The WJO is led by saxophonist Joey Berkley and includes trumpets: besides me, there’s Tony Kadleck, Craig Johnson, and Jim Rotundi; trombones Keith O'Quinn, Larry Farrell, George Flynn; saxophones Jay Brandford, David Brandom, Ralph Lalama, Eddie Xiques, and Berkley; pianist Ted Rosenthal; bassist Harvey S; and drummer Tony Jefferson.

There is great mutual respect throughout the band. Jim Rotundi and I split the Jazz trumpet solos on the band, Tony Kadleck plays lead, and Craig Johnson plays split lead. These are young guys in their early forties. I’ve been there and done that, and I’m happy to let them have it. If there’s something I want to play I’ll lean over and ask Tony, “Hey, do you mind if I play that?” But I’m not very interested in playing lead anymore; I prefer playing a lower part and being in the role of soloist.

 Role of lead trumpet in big bands

To me, the bass player is the heart and soul of any band, the timekeeper. His sound and pitch have a lot to do with how a group sounds. With all his drums and cymbals, a fine drummer is like a painter. His job is the coloration, augmenting the sounds of the various horn sections. Of course, the drummer also has a great deal to do with the intensity of the group.

The lead trumpet player is the interpreter of the music. While the lead trombone player and lead alto player are the leaders of their respective sections, tradition has dictated that they take their cues in interpretation and articulation from the lead trumpet player. That’s the traditional approach to the music and the role of the lead trumpet. This role was beautifully exemplified by the great lead trumpet players with whom I worked in New York City - Bernie Glow and Ernie Royal, who did all the Miles Davis/Gil Evans recordings, among others - and Snooky Young with the Basie band, who also became part of the New York studio scene for years before moving to California. Of course, their mentors were from the earlier bands, those of Jimmy Lunceford, Fletcher Henderson, Duke Ellington, Benny Goodman, and others.

For me, the happiest moments playing in the studios were those times we recorded a lot of Jazz records, and the trumpet section was Bernie Glow, Ernie Royal, Snooky Young, and me. What a lesson it was to learn from three of the greatest musicians who ever picked up a trumpet! To them, the lead trumpet player was like the concertmaster or the concertmistress of a symphony orchestra. They led the orchestra, but not through sheer force. Their natural musicality, their sound, and their rhythmic feeling made the rest of the orchestra naturally focus upon them and follow their lead. But as they led the orchestra, they also blended into it. As Snooky expressed it, “It should sound like an organ from top to bottom.” When you hear the recordings he made with the Basie Band of the late ‘50s and early ‘60s, you can hear exactly what he was talking about. The same can be heard on all the recordings on which Bernie and Ernie play. It is not about playing the highest, loudest notes. It has much more to do with sound, feel, interpretation, and natural musicality.

Regarding how a band sounds: The secret comes down to one word: listen. If all the players in the band are listening to everything that’s going on and know where they fit in musically, that band is going to sound very good. The problem with a lot of players is that they’re too busy focusing on themselves; they’re not listening to anyone else.  When they are not playing, they often talk to the guys next to them or fool around. They aren’t listening to whatever else may be going on around them in the music. I see this happening even in small groups. Guys go up to the microphone to play their solos, and they play well. The next guy comes up to play, and the person who just finished his solo walks over to the side and starts talking to one of the other musicians. When those who don’t respect the people they’re on the bandstand with enough to want to hear what they play and to learn from them, why do they bother to play with them at all! When I’m on the bandstand, I give everyone my rapt attention. That’s as it should be. Otherwise, I don’t want to be there.

Inspirational musicians

All along the way I’ve had people who have inspired me and who have been of tremendous help to me. There is my junior high school band director in Memphis, Jack Foster; my high school band director, A. E. McLain, one of the great high school band directors in the country; my trumpet teacher in Memphis, Perry Wilson; my four years at North Texas, studying with John Haynie and working with lab band directors Gene Hall and Leon Breeden. My six plus years studying with Carmine Caruso were so very special also.

There were players in Memphis and in the Dallas and Ft. Worth areas that were very good to this young kid they perceived had talent. They gave freely of their advice and let me sit next to them and play with them, which is where I learned many great lessons. This learning process has continued throughout my life in the professional world. It is certainly true of Stan Kenton and Woody Herman, and all the players in those bands. Of course, players such as Miles Davis, Dizzy Gillespie, and Clifford Brown influenced my trumpet playing.

Playing in the Thad Jones/Mel Lewis Orchestra was an unforgetable experience. Thad Jones stands up to anyone who has ever picked up a musical instrument. He was a creative genius. To be in that band at that time, filled with people like Snooky Young, Jimmy Nottingham, Richard Williams, Bob Brookmeyer, Garnett Brown, Richard Davis, Mel Lewis, and that wonderful saxophone section of Jerome Richardson, Jerry Dodgion, Eddie Daniels, Pepper Adams and Joe Farrell - it was truly amazing, and I learned so much from everyone. But when Thad picked up that horn, everyone listened with complete attention and in rapt admiration. He blew all of us away - every time!

There have been so many other people over my lifetime and in my career: Duke Pearson and all the guys in that band; Charlie Mariano and the times we spent teaching together and playing in the summers. Bill Mays and Rufus Reid continue to be great teachers to me. Ed Soph’s drumming is so different, so unique. Then again, there are so many people that you and others might never have heard of who have made just as big a difference in my musical life and personal development as these more well-known people I have mentioned.

Soloing with symphony orchestras

I have a library written for trumpet soloist, rhythm section and symphony orchestra - not big band and strings, but strictly orchestral instrumentation.  There are no saxophones. It’s  all other woodwinds - oboes, bassoons, clarinets.  The arrangements call for a typical orchestral brass section - three trumpets, three trombones, and four horns. I enjoy playing with orchestras very much. When standing in the middle of a large group as this and hearing what a real orchestra sounds like, I feel its absolute magnificence, particularly when the musicians are interested in what you do and want to be a part of it.

The music these orchestras are typically required to play when they performing music other than classical music (I hate to say “pops concerts”) is usually junk. They hate it unless they are playing for someone like Maureen McGovern, who has really fine arrangements. My arrangements have been written for me by Jack Cortner, Bill Mays, Jerry Ascione, Jack Cooper, and several others, and each one knows how to write for the orchestra, keeping it all in perspective. They don’t ask the orchestra players to do things they are unable to do, like swing. They also know how to integrate the Jazz quartet into the orchestral setting. These orchestrations are excellent.

That being said, once in a while at the beginning of a rehearsal, the typical attitude toward a “pops concert” carries over. I have had to stop an orchestra a few times and say to them, “I am as serious about my music as Yo-Yo Ma is about his music. The music you’re playing is beautifully orchestrated, and if you just put yourself into it, you’ll probably find that you enjoy it very much.” That stops any negative attitudes right there, appealing to the orchestra members’ pride, and as they open up to the music, they warm to it and accept it. Then they start having fun! This is so nice to see!

Also, the guys who travel with me - Rufus, Ed, and Bill - are such open people and marvelous players that it doesn’t take long for all of us to establish a rapport with the orchestra members. When Rufus Reid walks on stage and sets up with the quartet, most of the orchestra’s bass players know him because they’re all members of the International Bass Society. Every summer they hold their conference, and all these players mix. On breaks, the orchestra bassists are all around Rufus. When Bill Mays sits down at the piano and starts to warm up, he plays Czerny, Hanon, and Chopin from memory. The violinists look at him wondering, “Who the heck is this guy?” When Ed plays, he doesn’t try to overpower the orchestra, but rather helps them with time and feeling of each piece. They begin to hear how we integrate with them when we play together. And the four of us show a lot of appreciation for what they do. The respect becomes mutual, and we build on that.

I’ve never walked away from a concert where the people in the orchestra didn’t express how much they enjoyed having us with them – violinists, bassoonists, percussionists, whoever. We’ve also never played a concert where we didn’t receive standing ovations at the end. If the people who program symphony concerts - executive directors and musical directors - would think more creatively about Jazz, more “outside of the box,” trying to integrate programs like this into their “pops” series instead of some of the junk they put out there, they might find their audiences would be building instead of diminishing. Too many of these people are continuing to program concerts the same way they did forty-five years ago, and you know what? It doesn’t work anymore. I go to symphony concerts. I’m sixty-five, and I’m among the youngest group of listeners. That’s also true many times at Jazz concerts. A lot of criticism could be leveled at the venues in the Jazz area as well. If we want our music to survive, we had better start doing something to build our audiences.

Trumpet designing

Over the years, I designed trumpets for three companies. There were many innovations going on at that time, and I enjoyed being a part of it. The company I’ve worked with longest is the French Besson Company formerly owned by The Music Group. Ten years ago, I designed some trumpets for them, one of which remains their main B-flat trumpet model. I’m no longer involved in designing instruments, but it is nice to get e-mails occasionally from players who say, “I just bought one of the trumpets you designed, and I really enjoy playing it.”

Website www.marvinstamm.com

My website grew out of the printed version of my newsletter, Cadenzas, which I wrote for about five years. I was encouraged to do this by a friend and neighbor, Bret Primack, who also happened to be a very busy Jazz writer. As it was becoming more expensive to do a printed version of the newsletter, and Bret was into the Internet and designing websites early on, he suggested building a website for me, encouraging me to get into this new area. Now, replacing the printed and mailed version of Cadenzas, a new issue appears quarterly on my web site. I just let people on my e-mail list know it has been posted, and they are able to access and read it at their convenience.

Bret has also taught me how to edit the website myself, and I continually update and edit it - adding things, deleting other things, and learning more about it all the time. Recently, for example, as a result of the release of our new CD - The Stamm/Soph Project - Live at Birdland - I realized that people needed to be able to buy the CDs by credit card directly from the website. Some people no longer care to purchase anything by check or money order. I opened a Pay Pal account, and now anyone who wants to buy a CD can do so directly from the web site with a credit card. I receive the order immediately, and the CD is usually in the mail by the next day.

Bret Primack is a very creative guy and is usually in the forefront of new developments relating to Jazz on the Internet. When he designed and built my website, one of the things he wanted to do was make sure it would be easy to navigate. I believe he achieved his goal because, even though there is a lot of information on my site, many people remark about the ease of navigating it.

Recently I’ve added new pages on my website for my duo with Bill Mays, my CDs, my Discography, the CD reviews, and my performance reviews. These are all on separate pages with separate links to each. Once I did that, I had to edit every page to provide links from each page to every other page. That way, anybody can easily get from any page on the site to any other page. Many people have remarked that it is one of the better websites they have visited. I think that is quite a high compliment. Others tell me it’s one of the easiest to navigate, also a welcome compliment.

As I mentioned, I now have my online newsletter on the website.  Rather than having to mail the newsletter (I have about 1,200 people on my email list), I merely send a notice that the new edition of the newsletter has been posted. I inform my readers about the featured articles, provide easy links to the site, and hope they’ll go there to read it. I write a lot articles about Jazz and culture, about all areas of music and music education, and about what I see going on today pertaining to these issues.

There is also an “In Response” page where anyone who reads an article I’ve written is welcome to express his or her own thoughts and opinions - pro or con.  If it’s intelligently written, I will format it and post it on this page for my other readers to see. In every notice that the new issue of Cadenzas has been posted, I encourage people to respond to my articles. If people disagree with me, that is fine, because the idea is not only to put my own thoughts there, but rather to create a dialog among people. I want the site to be interactive with the people who visit the website. The funny thing is that I rarely know who or how many people read the newsletter. The payoff comes when I run into somebody in Oshkosh, Wisconsin, or Ludlow, Missouri, who says, “You know, so-and-so sent me the link to your newsletter, and I went to your website and read it. I think you really have something to say.”

Upcoming events

Most of my work is on the road, but it seems that this year I am doing a lot of playing around the New York area.  I’ve played a couple of concerts and club gigs in New York with groups led by Virginia Mayhew, a wonderful tenor saxophonist. I’m doing several things with Bill Mays, with his trio and with my quartet. The group will be playing this summer at several spots in New York and Connecticut. I’ve recently done a couple of recordings - a new CD with the George Gruntz Concert Jazz Band and also a guest soloist spot on a new CD of trombonist Scott Whitfield in tribute to his mentor and friend, Nat Adderly. I have also recorded with Donald Fagan of Steely Dan on his new solo CD and am a featured soloist along with saxophonist Walt Weiskopf. I’ll be doing some concerts and workshops at various schools and also teaching at a summer camp for a few days. I’ll be playing at a couple festivals and most likely doing a Jazz cruise in December with Mike Vax’s Kenton Alumni Band. I may also be going to Europe later in the year. And through it all, I will be performing with the Westchester Jazz Orchestra. Like a lot of the musicians who are able to work and make a living playing Jazz, I’m doing a lot of different things.